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to Just Another Tinfoil Hat with

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your host, Zillia Edgar. Join

0:36

Zillia as she walks us through some

0:38

of the most bizarre UFO cases and

0:41

incidents of high strangeness. Good

0:45

afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. I'm Just Another

0:47

Tinfoil Hat. Welcome to my show. Today

0:50

we are going to be discussing

0:52

one of my all-time favorite cases

0:54

of UFO occupant contact. And

0:56

that is the Simonton encounter.

0:59

Or as Dr. Heineck remembered it, the

1:01

man from Wisconsin with the pancakes. Yes,

1:04

I did say pancakes and Wisconsin. Seriously,

1:08

I am just so thrilled that one

1:10

of my favorite cases of the

1:12

weird happened in my state. And I know it's

1:15

a weird state, but as you'll see from this

1:17

upcoming story, it gets even weirder.

1:20

So this case happened in Eagle River, Wisconsin,

1:22

April 18th of 1961. Around

1:26

11 in the morning, Joe Simonton,

1:28

a chicken farmer, was eating

1:30

breakfast when he heard a noise outside

1:33

which he described as sounding like knobby

1:35

tires on wet pavement. Of

1:37

course, wondering what the heck the source of

1:39

this noise could be, he went outside to

1:42

take a look and saw a

1:44

bright silver object about 12 feet

1:46

tall and 30 feet in diameter,

1:48

shaped like two inverted bowls with

1:51

little exhaust pipes. The exhaust pipes

1:53

about six or seven inches in diameter,

1:55

spaced around the rim, hovering

1:58

slightly over the ground. So

2:00

as he's staring at this thing, a hatch

2:03

opens up on the side of it and he

2:05

looks in and sees three men. Not just any

2:07

men, he described them as looking like

2:09

Italians, each one about five feet tall

2:12

and wearing black turtlenecks

2:14

and knit helmets. So

2:17

one of these Italian-looking UFO occupants, closest

2:19

to the hatch, passes a container out

2:21

to Simonton that appears to be made

2:23

out of the same material as the

2:25

craft itself, and somehow

2:28

conveyed that they needed water. It's

2:31

interesting because across, I've listened to one

2:33

interview with Simonton and of

2:36

course he was interviewed many times by

2:38

many different people and it's never entirely

2:40

sure whether this communication was telepathic or

2:42

simply body language, but however it was

2:44

he understood that they needed water. So

2:48

Simonton, and this

2:51

is just, again, Wisconsin's a

2:53

weird state but this is just cliche

2:55

weird. It's like, okay, there's this, for

2:58

lack of a better term, flying

3:00

saucer, this craft hovering outside of my

3:02

house, there's these

3:04

Italian-looking occupants inside and

3:07

they're asking for water and Simonton is just like,

3:09

hey sure thing, man, let me get you that.

3:11

And that's exactly what he did. He went inside,

3:14

got the water, and came

3:16

back out. Now, when he came back

3:18

over with the water, he

3:20

was able to get a better view of the inside of

3:22

the ship and he said that the interior was dark,

3:24

about the color of wrought iron. There

3:27

is no discernible light source, which is common

3:30

with people who see the inside of UFOs.

3:33

And it was filled with instrument panels

3:35

and there was this generator-like hum

3:37

present. But not only that, one

3:40

of these entities appeared to

3:42

be frying something on a flameless

3:44

grill. So Simonton

3:47

motioned that he was just interested in what this

3:49

guy was doing and perhaps

3:51

mistakenly thinking that he wanted a sample,

3:54

one of these entities who was dressed alike to

3:56

the other two but had a slight difference. He

3:58

had red trim on his pants. hands, handed

4:01

him three of the now

4:03

infamous alien pancakes. So

4:06

then this entity closest to Simonton

4:08

attached some sort of hook to

4:11

a belt on his clothing, and

4:15

I guess sort of moved away as the

4:17

hatch closed, and when the hatch closed it

4:19

left absolutely no impression on

4:21

the side of the object, which

4:23

rose 20 feet and then kind of took

4:25

off in a southern direction, apparently

4:27

even bowing some of the nearby pine trees. Now

4:31

Simonton contacted the sheriff, a man who at

4:33

this point in time he had known for

4:35

fourteen years, and this is

4:37

a really good spot to mention that Simonton was

4:39

really well respected in his community. He

4:41

wasn't the sort of person that would

4:44

be making stuff like this up for

4:46

attention or fame, and like

4:48

many witnesses he says that after the

4:50

whole thing, the media frenzy that ensued,

4:52

he really wished that he hadn't come

4:54

forward with his experience at all, because

4:57

not only was there a police investigation,

5:01

but there was an air force investigation as well.

5:05

Jayon Hynek actually was involved with

5:08

this investigation, and Hynek is an

5:10

interesting study in and of himself, and

5:12

that whole thing is just such a can of worms, because

5:15

he worked with projects Sine, Grudge, and

5:17

Blue Book, and was even the person

5:20

to utter the infamous swamp gas statement.

5:23

But the gist of it is that after

5:25

so many years of looking at the UFO

5:27

problem, he really came to the conclusion that

5:29

there was something to it after all. And

5:32

I'd say he'd started out kind of more

5:34

as a skeptic, but yeah, definitely as he

5:36

worked through so many of these cases, it

5:39

became apparent to him that there's

5:41

more than, you know, misidentification

5:44

or mental imbalance to

5:46

a lot of sightings. So

5:50

anyway, in the case of the Simonton encounter,

5:52

however, the official air force conclusion was

5:55

that Simonton had inserted a waking

5:57

dream on the reality around the

5:59

scene. him. And

6:01

here's the trick is that this

6:03

idea suited both conventional scientists, who

6:06

typically really don't want much to do with

6:08

UFO problem in general, and the

6:11

hardcore ufologists, who always have

6:13

a hard enough time appearing

6:15

legit without such problems as

6:17

interstellar breakfast foods. And

6:21

the big nail in this coffin is

6:24

unfortunately the pancakes themselves. I

6:26

mean, it's ridiculous. There's a picture of Simonton

6:28

holding the pancakes, and I'm not going to

6:30

lie, they don't even really look like pancakes.

6:32

They look awful. They're these like,

6:35

they're about this big, these like

6:37

porous sort of, I

6:40

don't know, like hard cracker like

6:42

objects. And you

6:44

know, they look terrible. Apparently they

6:46

were. Simonton, barring any concerns about

6:48

radiation or alien viruses or

6:50

anything, actually ate one and said that

6:52

it tastes like cardboard. So

6:58

Simonton tried one, and then he sent another

7:00

one out to be tested by the Food

7:02

and Drug Laboratory of the U.S. Department of

7:04

Health, Education, and Welfare. And

7:07

I'll cut the suspense. The

7:09

pancakes came back as

7:11

ordinary terrestrial

7:14

materials. So

7:16

this brings up somehow even

7:18

more questions than the simple fact

7:21

of alien pancakes. Because

7:23

if we are to

7:25

believe Simonton's encounter, which barring

7:27

the Air Force, you know, explanation, in

7:30

every official capacity he proved to be a

7:32

legitimate witness who really believed in what he

7:35

had observed and experienced, and

7:38

honestly had evidence, trace evidence in

7:40

the form of these pancakes to

7:42

boot, then why were

7:44

they made out of earthly materials? I mean,

7:48

did the aliens just, you know, drop in, pop out

7:50

to the store, grab some Crisco and wheat

7:52

bran and buckwheat hulls and fry up some

7:54

pancakes? It just really doesn't make any sense. Hey,

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true crime to catch up

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on the latest episodes without

9:24

the ads. So

9:29

it is a really funny

9:31

thing to note, but when I first

9:33

came across this encounter, I was very

9:36

much into the strictly flesh and blood

9:38

extraterrestrial biological entity theory for

9:40

UFO occupant encounters. And

9:43

that being said, when I heard that the

9:45

Air Force was involved, you

9:48

know, the only explanation I could find

9:50

for the pancakes coming back as being

9:52

of earthly materials was, you probably guessed

9:54

it, cover up. This

9:56

is the biggest news since Roswell, the case of

9:59

the alien. pancakes. And

10:01

that's kind of the issue

10:04

using conventional models is the further along

10:07

you get on any line of reasoning honestly

10:09

the more ridiculous it tends to become.

10:12

And barring anything else you still

10:14

have the question of do aliens

10:16

eat pancakes? There's also the

10:19

issue of how like in many reports

10:22

they had no sort of protective gear

10:24

on. They were wearing just turtleneck two-piece

10:26

suits and knit caps. I

10:28

mean how do they breathe our air or exist

10:30

in our atmosphere? And if they were prepared

10:32

enough to have ingredients why did they need

10:35

the water from Joe Simonton? Really

10:37

to look at the Simonton case since totality

10:39

is to see patterns of a very much

10:42

older phenomenon that of fairy lore.

10:45

Most people, many people,

10:47

make connections between current

10:49

UFO occupant encounters and

10:51

fairies in so much as

10:53

to say that what people

10:55

used to consider fairies are get this

10:58

guy's actually aliens. And

11:00

you know we were mistaken what we thought were elves,

11:02

fairies, gnomes, good folk, the gentry, whatever you

11:04

want to call it. You know no

11:06

that's not it they're actually space aliens. We just

11:09

couldn't get that back in the dark ages. That's

11:11

why we came up with this fairy lore. But

11:14

now we got it you know Marvin we got

11:16

your number. It's actually those crafty aliens with

11:18

their spacecraft. However

11:20

I always kind of get to

11:22

this point then where I wonder what's going to be

11:24

called when the current model of UFO

11:27

occupants from other planets becomes

11:29

outdated. Because

11:31

really currently there's a problem.

11:33

Most, I shouldn't say

11:36

most, but many different sightings of this

11:38

what we consider a single phenomenon don't

11:41

fit this current model. I mean

11:43

using only the Eagle River incident

11:46

as an example we have many of the problems

11:48

easily presented here. When

11:50

Joe Simonton was handed pancakes from supposedly

11:53

another world or occupants of another world

11:56

why were they made out of buckwheat

11:58

and soybean hulls and hydrogenated oil? Why

12:01

were the radiation readings normal? Why

12:03

did they need water? Why did they give him

12:05

food? Why did he come into contact with beings

12:07

that looked like Italians instead of,

12:10

I don't know, crystalline silicon-based life

12:12

forms or something like that? I

12:14

mean, even if you subscribe to the idea

12:16

that mankind was either planted

12:19

or altered by similar life forms,

12:22

the possibility of them breathing our air and

12:24

drinking our water, it just,

12:26

it really doesn't make that much sense.

12:28

And even if they could, you know,

12:31

then I have serious concerns as to why

12:34

such a seemingly or supposedly advanced

12:36

society, if they

12:39

created us and apparently are concerned with us,

12:42

spend their time handing out pancakes

12:44

to chicken farmers and common earth

12:46

rocks to farm wives. It

12:49

really, it doesn't neatly follow this idea

12:51

of the

12:54

alien presence model that has been

12:56

popular for most of this

12:59

past century and what

13:01

fits our frame of reference for this time. Yet

13:04

Simonton was a reliable witness. All of these

13:07

things that don't make sense and points that

13:09

don't add up are present in his encounter,

13:11

which pretty much everyone who

13:14

investigated it claims he believed he experienced

13:16

and he had physical evidence to back

13:18

that up. I mean, it

13:21

can't follow, yet if we dedicate ourselves to

13:23

really understanding the problem of UFO encounters,

13:25

we kind of have to follow it. So

13:29

this whole case is covered extensively

13:32

in Passport to Magonia, which of course was Jacques

13:34

Vallée's groundbreaking book about

13:36

the ties between fairy lore

13:39

and current alien encounters, and Keel

13:42

discussed this in some length

13:44

in most of his works as well. And

13:47

surprisingly enough, the point that really

13:49

launches the Simonton encounter right into

13:51

fairy land is the famous flapjacks.

13:54

For some bizarre reason, baked

13:56

goods feature prominently across mythologies and

13:59

religions wide. I mean, from

14:01

the importance of unleavened bread in

14:03

the Judeo-Christian traditions to

14:06

many documented encounters of fairies giving

14:08

people all manner of bakery items

14:10

across Europe, for some reason

14:13

there seems to be a special

14:15

connection between specifically flat cakes

14:17

and supernatural encounters. And

14:19

again, this was covered in Passport to Magonia. Ridiculous

14:22

as it sounds, a very well documented case

14:24

of what was considered demonic torment in the

14:26

1600s began with a mysterious pancake.

14:31

So this also kind of brings

14:34

up a point that Keel uncovered,

14:36

which is that most contact ease,

14:38

people who believe they're being contacted

14:40

by other intelligences or outside influences,

14:44

have a high starch diet. And

14:47

another side to Keel's work is

14:50

another anomaly from the pancakes, and that

14:52

is the absence of salt. So

14:55

as was pointed out in Passport to Magonia,

14:58

there is a precedent in fairy lore

15:00

for that fairies cannot eat or do

15:02

not like salt. On

15:04

the flip side, however, through Keel's work,

15:06

we have many reports of the men

15:09

in black downright devouring salt. The

15:12

strange case covered in the Mothman prophecies

15:15

was one even asked for salt to

15:17

take a pill. So

15:20

as we eventually get to with all of

15:22

these different encounters, what does it all mean?

15:24

I mean, here you have Simonton's entities,

15:27

which came from the sky in an object that

15:29

looks a heck of a lot like what we

15:31

consider to be a flying saucer, giving

15:33

him unsalted pancakes, thus in line

15:35

with the older tradition of fairy lore.

15:38

To the opposite point, you have the decidedly unearthly

15:40

men in black, also known to come down

15:42

from the sky and flying saucers in addition

15:44

to their black catalacts, making

15:47

a point to request salt. I

15:50

mean, in trying to establish patterns between these

15:52

two different types of phenomena, these two

15:54

different entities, it's almost as though points

15:57

arise simply to confound other points.

16:00

Another bizarre point is the request for

16:02

help or the implication that help is

16:04

needed. This is a

16:06

really huge commonality between

16:08

current paranormal encounters and

16:12

fairy lore. I mean, it's easy

16:14

enough to see even in fairy tales, and

16:16

the current model of UFO's crash

16:19

landing also fits this

16:21

theme. Even religious apparitions like Our

16:23

Lady of Guadalupe often fall

16:25

into this category as well. And

16:28

it gets even creepier. I've read cryptid

16:30

reports where people are under the assumption

16:32

that the literal monster that they are

16:34

looking at needs help or

16:37

is somehow hurt or injured and they want

16:39

to go help it. It's

16:41

to the point where this seems like more

16:44

than just your basic human empathy, it

16:46

seems like to be a genuine

16:48

impression somehow attached to these

16:50

sightings. So I guess

16:52

the point here, amid all these contradictions

16:55

and paradoxes and pancakes, is

16:57

that while Simonton's encounter is considered an

16:59

outlier in the current model

17:01

of UFO sightings, it's

17:03

most certainly not in regards to a

17:05

far older model of contact. And

17:08

again, I really do. I just wonder what people

17:10

will call it a couple hundred years from now

17:12

when we're being laughed at for calling

17:15

these entities aliens and extraterrestrials.

17:18

So with that said, I'm just another

17:20

Tinfoil Hat. Signing off.

17:25

This has been Just Another Tinfoil Hat

17:27

with Zelia Edgar. Be

17:29

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